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I find all of these posts very interesting. I used to belong to a stamper's club and have quit. I got tired of ordering a little bit every month. I'd rather order infrequently (once or twice a year) and get the hostess benefits myself. I hope that doesn't change. I do feel that Stampin' Up is WAY overpriced but good quality. They tend to get the "trends" in long after you can find them in the stores (Big Shot, Envelope Punch Board for a couple of examples). I think they are high priced because of the demo benefits. I know demo's won't like my saying that BUT my demo went to convention, leadership, wherever the trip was this year, and was one of those who went to the thing they have for the top 100 demos (can't remember what that's called). All of those trips cost a lot of money!
BTW I never did buy any of the Blendabilities. I have some copics and really like them.
Well order early because hostess benefits drop in October. ( I think its October....A demo can tell you. I'm ordering larger this month so I can get sab items and hostess credits.
It speaks to the integrity of Stampin'Up! that they are willing to admit fault and work to correct the issue, rather than taking the stance of a certain other company whose mantra seems to be "customers are a dishonest, scheming lot out to get us"... ;)
Well order early because hostess benefits drop in October. ( I think its October....A demo can tell you. I'm ordering larger this month so I can get sab items and hostess credits.
It speaks to the integrity of Stampin'Up! that they are willing to admit fault and work to correct the issue, rather than taking the stance of a certain other company whose mantra seems to be "customers are a dishonest, scheming lot out to get us"... ;)
Got to agree with that!
But, I'm sad I got caught in the middle of this. I'd ordered 3 sets as SAB items. One was Crumb Cake. I got that set. The Cherry Cobbler and Old Olive were listed as back ordered when my order got here and then removed a few days later. So, instead of coloring red flowers with green stems...I can color...the dirt.
I know, it's a first world problem for sure, but a little sad because I don't think I would have selected just one set...of any color, with no other sets to go with it.
On the other hand (there's ALWAYS another way to see it!), I was amazed I really could create a blend with those brown markers, so I just might indeed end up giving some other alcohol markers a try.
This comes from the Demo side of SU: You are no doubt very much aware of the product quality concerns we�ve been experiencing with Blendabilities, and we thank you for your patience as we�ve worked through this sensitive issue.
We�ve done everything possible to work with our manufacturer, but with no solution in sight, we�ve had to make the difficult decision to permanently discontinue this popular product line.
jasimoms you can return your set and get your money back~
Thanks...but I'm not sure I can do that. The Crumb Cake was a SAB product. When I called SU to get different SAB items for the other 2 marker sets, I did inquire. Since the Crumb Cake set was "working" (i.e. none were dry)...it really wasn't an option to get a different item.
I do appreciate the idea. It really is a very small thing, more "a little disappointed - I was looking forward to trying this" as opposed to "really upset".
So, I came in late to this discussion, but I read every simple post in this thread and am fascinated by the whole thing! I was a hobby demo for a year then quit. I found other paper and stamps that suited me. I buy retired SU sets from individuals, but nothing from SU since I quit last year.
Business is business, and SU will do what they can to stay afloat. Here's what I think the source of the problem is...at least for me...and it has nothing to do with info not being released or reducing bene's or demos leaving. It has everything to do with Shelli.
I hesitated to join discussions re SU because I found current demos could get pretty nasty if they perceived anything as being detrimental or disloyal to SU! And I always found that strange! Because anyone who can do basic math can see that SU is not a business model that favors the demos. The compensation plan will have you working like a dog to make enough to break even. I'm not being negative...it's all there in black and white. So why would so many of us be at odds...demos with seemingly blind loyalty to SU and no tolerance for any dissension and the other side, who were disgusted beyond what would be considered reasonable for a company trying to pump up profits...and once again, it goes straight back to shelli.
You see, SU worked hard to make you forget THEY were a business. They were always talking about 'personal values' and 'spirituality' and 'only wanting women to grow their business so that they could attain things that were intangible...happiness, independence, etc. and they did this well...TOO well. Because if you know where to look and are able to view the info sans emotion, you'll see that SU is struggling. Because they're a private company, they don't have to release their financials. But they have trended at a loss for several years, now, and they haven't recouped any of it. So, just like any other business, now they've got to take drastic steps to survive. But due to the fact so many people Bought into the emotional aspect, SU!'s scramble to bolster earnings feels like a betrayal. Had Shelli balanced the business with the personal a little better, I don't think we'd see the emotion we're seeing on both sides of the spectrum. Shelli hid the business in the emotional and the emotion is still there, but the business is not.
We'd be better off if we separated ourselves from that emotion. Passion is great, but if hat passion blinds you, then you make foolhardy statements and decisions. At the other end, letting go of that feeling of betrayal by realizing SU is a company and that Shelli messed up by not balancing the the 2 and is trying to hold on until they can find the sweet spot again, may help that anger. For me, i don't know if SU will survive or not...at this rate, I say no. Simply because they have never faced what's gappening now in the industry. You think Tim Holtz didn't take a chunk of their business cash flow? Local stores are folding right and left, because they can't compete with internet prices...you think SU is impervious to that as well?
Sorry..I didn't mean to write a book. Just my 2 cents. But this was an AWESOME thread ! IM neither for or against the demise of SU. They really shaped the industry. They just have problems trying to keep up. I think it would be smarter for them to incorporate outside trends instead of being so adamant about labeling non SU things as contraband...that really doesn't help either side...it indoctrinates the supporters and alienates a huge chunk of potential customers. I'm not opening myself up to criticism by being called out for having contraband! But again...those are my thoughts. And what do I know anyway? Except that I'm tired of writing and need a snack. Yep...fooood! I'm out! Big hugs, y'all!
__________________ Carmen
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I only get upset when people insult my intelligence by saying that I'm following SU on blind faith and stuff like that. I'm a demo because I chose to be. Every single day I make the decision to continue because I want to. Plain and simple. We all have to do what we feel we want to do. I don't agree with a lot of the opinions you shared but that's no big deal. We all have different opinions :-) But I know exactly what I'm doing and why I'm doing it. And I chose to focus on the positives about most things (SU and otherwise). Of course I see negative things but I chose not to dwell on them, at least most of the time :-) I'm not super happy with some of the things that have happened recently but I'm not dwelling on it.
Good morning ladies! I partially agree with a lot of what Carmen had to say. Stampin' Up in not invinceable! They could and might go belly up. Look at what happened to Creative Memories! Hot as hot one day and belly up the next! I LOVE Stampin' Up's products and their quality BUT they always seem to be a step behind the industry. They came out with a Big Shot years after it was in the stores. They came out with "nesties" years after nesties were made and distributed by Spellbinders. I could go on and on.... The COULD very likely go belly up.
I read somewhere that they are doing this for their demo's. The average customer could CARE LESS about what the bottom line is for their demos - they care about themselves and what's in it for them. I was about to do a qualifying order with my demo (to get the hostess benefits) and now I'm not so sure what I'll do...
So, I came in late to this discussion, but I read every simple post in this thread and am fascinated by the whole thing! I was a hobby demo for a year then quit. I found other paper and stamps that suited me. I buy retired SU sets from individuals, but nothing from SU since I quit last year.
Business is business, and SU will do what they can to stay afloat. Here's what I think the source of the problem is...at least for me...and it has nothing to do with info not being released or reducing bene's or demos leaving. It has everything to do with Shelli.
I hesitated to join discussions re SU because I found current demos could get pretty nasty if they perceived anything as being detrimental or disloyal to SU! And I always found that strange! Because anyone who can do basic math can see that SU is not a business model that favors the demos. The compensation plan will have you working like a dog to make enough to break even. I'm not being negative...it's all there in black and white. So why would so many of us be at odds...demos with seemingly blind loyalty to SU and no tolerance for any dissension and the other side, who were disgusted beyond what would be considered reasonable for a company trying to pump up profits...and once again, it goes straight back to shelli.
You see, SU worked hard to make you forget THEY were a business. They were always talking about 'personal values' and 'spirituality' and 'only wanting women to grow their business so that they could attain things that were intangible...happiness, independence, etc. and they did this well...TOO well. Because if you know where to look and are able to view the info sans emotion, you'll see that SU is struggling. Because they're a private company, they don't have to release their financials. But they have trended at a loss for several years, now, and they haven't recouped any of it. So, just like any other business, now they've got to take drastic steps to survive. But due to the fact so many people Bought into the emotional aspect, SU!'s scramble to bolster earnings feels like a betrayal. Had Shelli balanced the business with the personal a little better, I don't think we'd see the emotion we're seeing on both sides of the spectrum. Shelli hid the business in the emotional and the emotion is still there, but the business is not.
We'd be better off if we separated ourselves from that emotion. Passion is great, but if hat passion blinds you, then you make foolhardy statements and decisions. At the other end, letting go of that feeling of betrayal by realizing SU is a company and that Shelli messed up by not balancing the the 2 and is trying to hold on until they can find the sweet spot again, may help that anger. For me, i don't know if SU will survive or not...at this rate, I say no. Simply because they have never faced what's gappening now in the industry. You think Tim Holtz didn't take a chunk of their business cash flow? Local stores are folding right and left, because they can't compete with internet prices...you think SU is impervious to that as well?
Sorry..I didn't mean to write a book. Just my 2 cents. But this was an AWESOME thread ! IM neither for or against the demise of SU. They really shaped the industry. They just have problems trying to keep up. I think it would be smarter for them to incorporate outside trends instead of being so adamant about labeling non SU things as contraband...that really doesn't help either side...it indoctrinates the supporters and alienates a huge chunk of potential customers. I'm not opening myself up to criticism by being called out for having contraband! But again...those are my thoughts. And what do I know anyway? Except that I'm tired of writing and need a snack. Yep...fooood! I'm out! Big hugs, y'all!
Salome000, please provide source for validation for SU's three year trending financial loss with no recoupment. Without validation, sounds like an opinion presented as fact, contrary to statements from SU. Would be interested in validating info in the decision making process.
First of all, I might should have repeated the "Both sides are way to emotional and take things personally because SU did a great job of making a business about something more...they gave it a heart" which, quite frankly, is a heck of a compliment. Look at how many business spend millions to research how to connect emotionally with their clients!!! SU has done it better than anyone! Just look at the responses here!!! Everyone goes a little over the top if you take an opposite position! SU's only fault is that they didn't balance the business with the heart, just like other companies do great with the business end but don't connect emotionally. But since this thread is about SU, of course I'm going to be talking about them specifically!!!!!
I DO think that reps are a little on the touchy side with criticisms of SU but I can't blame you...SU is your personal business, so I would take it personally too...seriously..I don't blame you a bit. I really did try to balance my opinions but if I didnt, ny only defense is that it was 2 am and I was really hungry.
I regret saying that about the financials. I know a little more than most and certainly more than has ever been released. Why? Because I know a couple of people who aren't demos...they work for the company...and they are concerned with continued profitability, as well as the downturn over the past few years. But then again, who doesn't work for a company that isn't concerned about it's continued profitability? While I can't produce papers or memos, I can source my comments only to my discussions with corporate employees. Who knows...maybe they were just making it up?? Who knows...I just related the conversation because this industry has been hit HARD by Internet competition. Even if I knew no one at the corporate level, common sense alone (along with the recent changes) should tell you that they have to start strategizing to stay competitive. The problem will be the emotional brand they created, which was phenomenally successful...but is now starting to bite them in the rear ended a bit.
While it's not an easy road to build a successful business with SU, or and mlm or franchise, for that matter, is because you're stepping into a business that has already built the name and reputation that you need to sell...of COURSE you're going to have to work hard!! But any business you run yourself requires that and I have no idea why stating that fact should be so offensive!! Except that SU! tends to make it seem an easy thing to do...and its not. I know 1 highly successful demo and she works harder than I ever have in my LIFE. I admire the heck out her! And believe it or not, she and I have these discussions!! She told me once that there are 3 types of demos...hobbyists (of which I was one), demos who wanted to make enough to offset their hobby costs and career demos. Most people who join fall I to category one or two, but believe they fall in category 3, simply because they believe that it's easy to make a living through an mlm. They soon figure out that it's not a walk in the park, which can lead to disenfranchised customers/demos. The woman I know makes it a point to recruit using those 3 levels and makes sure that anyone signing on knows the realities. From what I understand, her down line is not that large but everyone of them have been on board 5 years or more. Personally, I think that's smart!!
Besides, she enjoys our discussions because I throw out questions or opinions she may not have thought of, and she says it makes her a better recruiter and salesperson. And her love for SU and her job is without question. That being said, she understands that only one person has walked on this earth who was perfect...and since He's not running SU!, she can separate her passion from business and not become consumed by either.
Man! I need to call her and tell her I just realized I really want to be her in my next life. (Grin)
I'm blunt and have never been very polished, which makes the whole 'winning friends and influencing people' a little difficult. So take my comments in the spirit in which they were intended, and that intention was to have frank discussions about a company, no matter if we claim to be happy or upset with it, has impacted us all-at one time or another-in a positive way and gave us tools along the way for us to access the artist that resides in every single soul on this earth. Much love and my apologies if I hurt any feelings!!!
__________________ Carmen
Slightly Manic, Full-On ADHD and currently stalked by my OCD
I am a:
Proud Fan Club Member
PROUD Splitcoast Dirty Dozen Alumni
And because everybody else has one and I HATE being left out, here's my blog papercraftgoddess.com
Well order early because hostess benefits drop in October. ( I think its October....A demo can tell you. I'm ordering larger this month so I can get sab items and hostess credits.
That's exactly what I intended to do but now I'm not so sure.... Do I want to support a company that isn't in it for their customers but all in it for themselves and their demos? Yes I know companies are in it for profitability but it irks me when I realize I pay more so the demos can win fabulous trips to fantastic locations. I wish there was a line similar to SU that could be purchased at places like Walmart and Target where of course there would be a mark up for profitability but not to send employees to God knows where! Unfortunately there isn't. Target and Walmart have small departments with inferior products. I'm not big on on line ordering because you can't "see and feel" what you're buying so you know the quality of the item.
You do realize that most demos don't earn the trips right? Most of us are working for 20%. With the changes if a demo sells above a certain amount a year they will make 25%. I am not exactly getting rich selling crafting supplies.
Either way, I would rather shop with companies that treat their employees well.
I just placed a $100 order. I know what I like and since I am getting what I want, I'll continue to buy. All companies are in it to make a profit. I'm not crazy about their special trips, but I guess if those women are selling lots, they should probably get rewarded in some way. My demo is not making any money. We all buy because we want or need something. She just makes the minimum in sales to remain active, not because she doesn't try, but because she can't get more people interested. So she will never get to attend a special trip or be rewarded, even though she's trying hard to sell and get others interested. Just doesn't seem fair that she's working hard with no perks. Just my 2 cents.
I also think it is pretty typical for sales jobs where the person works for commission for there to be bonuses, trips, etc. for their highest achievers.
I also think it is pretty typical for sales jobs where the person works for commission for there to be bonuses, trips, etc. for their highest achievers.
That's definitely true, I feel bad for the person who is working hard for a "commission" and can't get anyone interested. She still does the work, buys catalogs, hands them out, talks to people about it. Some people she's given catalogs even had the nerve to take her catalog and order from someone else! What's a gal to do? I guess she should now charge for the catalog and tell them they'll get their money back on their first order.
I have no stake in this whatsoever. I just love the product and how the papers, inks, stamps and dies match if you want. And they stand behind their product when I get something that needs returned. I also branched out recently and have been purchasing from SNSS, ODBD and my LSS orders stuff for me. SO I'm not a one trick pony, but I do like the product. Maybe what I love best is the monthly card class my demo has. We make cards, have snacks, and fellowship. We've become best friends now.
I also think it is pretty typical for sales jobs where the person works for commission for there to be bonuses, trips, etc. for their highest achievers.
It is very, very common for this to be the case. That being said, there are usually incremental "perks" that seem to be easier to achieve than those that many MLM companies (not just SU!) offer their reps. They really, really incentivize recruiting and don't offer much to those who have little or no downline. That is exactly what keeps me from being a rep for ANY of them, and probably the frustration of many who are commenting here. The gap between the "haves" and the "have nots" grows ever wider, and when there is very little reward for a lot of effort it gets aggravating.
THAT being said, my thought is that those who have been successful at recruiting and retaining their downline and customer base - and everything else that went into making them the "highest achievers" - started the same place as anyone else who signed on. They are successful because they intended to be, and did what it took to get there. You don't reach that level by coasting, at least not initially. I would imagine that you do get to a point where you can sort of go on autopilot, but to reach that point you have to bust your backside in the early stages.
I've known hobby demos bemoaning the trips and perks that the highest achievers got while I watched them do literally not one thing to build their own business. It won't just fall in your lap. I'm not motivated or passionate enough to do what it takes to be successful in this business model, so I stay out of it, plain and simple!
Still, it would be nice if there were incremental perks vs. an all-or-nothing reward system...
That's definitely true, I feel bad for the person who is working hard for a "commission" and can't get anyone interested. She still does the work, buys catalogs, hands them out, talks to people about it. Some people she's given catalogs even had the nerve to take her catalog and order from someone else! What's a gal to do? I guess she should now charge for the catalog and tell them they'll get their money back on their first order.
I have no stake in this whatsoever. I just love the product and how the papers, inks, stamps and dies match if you want. And they stand behind their product when I get something that needs returned. I also branched out recently and have been purchasing from SNSS, ODBD and my LSS orders stuff for me. SO I'm not a one trick pony, but I do like the product. Maybe what I love best is the monthly card class my demo has. We make cards, have snacks, and fellowship. We've become best friends now.
Sorry, I should of used quotes, because I was referring to the poster that thought Stampin Up was unique in the sales world for offering trips and bonuses. I totally understand what you saying about your demo, and I think it is very kind for you to see how much work she puts into it.
Personally, I take the risk of not making that much money by deciding to work with a company where I will only be get paid commission/instant income. But, it also comes with some awesome perks. I only work when I want to, buy the product I like, sometimes get cool free stuff from Stampin up just for doing something as small as booking x number of events, get the chance to preorder, etc. I am very happy to make just enough to support my hobby. That's all I really wanted to make anyway.
Some examples:
Bookathons: earn free items for booking x many events (one time it was 3 events for 400 dollars worth of products!)
Great rewards: we get points based on what we sell that we can then put towards free catalogs, products etc.
Various sales based product earnings: sell x many paper pumpkins get one free etc
Chance to earn free products based on how much we sell during Saleabration.
There are also awards that apply more to mid level demos and so on. But, there absolutely are rewards available to every level of demo.
Thank you for clarifying. I suppose I was thinking it was sort of an "apples to oranges" as far as correlation of effort to perk, rather than "apples to apples", but at least there's something, and that's better than nothing, for sure. And, as has been stated many, many times before - if you love the product, the people and the discount, those are perks, too. I suppose if someone was really, truly in it to make money, they would exert the effort required to get to those higher levels.
<--Never won a trip.
<--Doesn't have a huge downline.
<--Never won an award for sales.
<--Never won an award for recruiting.
BUT
My business pays for all my stamps, paper, ink, etc. And if you ever saw my stamp room, you'd know that I have (ahem) a lot of all of the above.
My business allows me to go to convention sometimes, where I get to spend time with my friends and learn a few things. It's fun.
My business has occasionally allowed me to pay a few bills or pay for Christmas. Most of the money I make I use to buy my own toys but sometimes I have been able to supplement our income to help pay some bills. This is a good thing.
My business has given me more self-confidence and self-esteem than just about anything I have ever done in my life.
Most importantly, my business has brought me the best friendships I have ever had.
Do I think Stampin' Up! is in business to make money? Er...yeah. Otherwise, it would be a charity. Would you go into business NOT to make money? If you did, I can guarantee, you wouldn't be in business long.
Do I think that Stampin' Up! cares nothing about it's customers or demonstrators? No, I don't feel that way. Any company has to balance three things, relations with customers, relations with sales force/staff, and the bottom line. It's like a stool. Make one of these legs too short, and the stool will fall over. Since hostess benefits are being reduced, I would like to think there is going to be something else that is going to be good for the customer, maybe more special sales or other offers. Frankly, most of my business is not done with hostesses any longer but individual online sales. So maybe there will be more programs catering to individual customers rather than a large emphasis on parties as there has been in the past. Hard to tell.
Do I think Stampin' Up! is in trouble? No, not really, at least not more than any other craft/hobby business, and probably less than most. The economy has hit everyone hard, and I really don't think they are an exception to the rule. This industry, as well, is one that has been declining. This is true of the whole scrapbooking/papercrafting industry. There is a notable difference between SU! and some of the other companies out there and that is that SU! has never borrowed money. They are completely debt-free. This has put them in a position to stay in business when a lot of other companies have folded. Will they continue to stay in business? Who can tell? I think there are always disgruntled ex-employees and current employees in any company that have nothing good to say. But let's say they do go out of business. Nothing will happen to me as a result. I am not required to hold a large inventory like other direct sales consultants are. All the stuff I have is my own stuff, not inventory. And even then, I've never had trouble selling off what I don't want any more. Frankly, it's not something I worry about. And honestly, the past year and a half, I found that my business has taken a turn for the better. And for the Metro Detroit area, that is saying a lot.
Do I think Stampin' Up! is perfect? Oh heck no. Most demonstrators know there are flaws in the company, just like any other company. The idea that I am a demonstrator because Shelli (may she live forever) snared me with an emotional appeal all the while she was reaching behind my back to lift my wallet out of my purse makes me laugh.
Do I like the recent changes? Not really, but at my age I don't enjoy change. I've been doing this for 12 years now. I have thought about quitting almost every single year for the past 12 years, but I always give it another quarter and by then I change my mind. I have found in the last 12 years that you only get out what you put in. If I wanted to throw myself into this full time, I could probably do a lot better, but I've found a balance in how I do this that I like.
Do I think Stampin' Up! tends to be behind the trends? Yup, it's always been a problem. But then, this problem is something that exists within this kind of business model. You have a yearly catalog that you have to spend the entire year developing products for. Once the deadline for the catalog has passed, anything new that comes down the pipe are going to have to wait until the next catalog. Plus, companies like Stampin' Up! either will develop their own version of a product or they have to come to an agreement with a major manufacturer to make their products for them. This all takes time. A retail brick and mortar or online store only needs to go to CHA and pick out what they want to carry and order it. That's why they have the latest thing as soon as it comes out. SU! has to spend the time trying to either come up with their own version or contract with a company like Sissix (Big Shot) or EKSuccess (punches). With the Blendabilities, naturally they HAD to be in our colors or there was no point. There is no point in carrying alcohol markers that don't match our colors. I wish that Blendabilities could have succeeded, oh yes I do. I have some Copics but having those three blending colors that I knew would match our cardstock was a great thing. I'm hoping they can come out with another line that will be better at not drying out.
Anyway, being a demonstrator is something I choose to do because I like it. I get a lot out of being a demonstrator, most of which has nothing to do with how much money I make. The day I stop getting anything out of it will be the day I walk away, but I will not have bitter memories because the whole experience has been a great one for me.
I think the whole thing is being blown out of proportion. When push comes to shove if one likes the product they're going to buy it. As far as the demo, I'm happy mine is going to make more. I do, sometimes, get a little turned off when I read so many posts defending every aspect SU, but do understand posters are passionate about a company they care about. And I have to add, I've been just as passionate if it's a company I love.
I just placed a $100 order. I know what I like and since I am getting what I want, I'll continue to buy. All companies are in it to make a profit. I'm not crazy about their special trips, but I guess if those women are selling lots, they should probably get rewarded in some way. My demo is not making any money. We all buy because we want or need something. She just makes the minimum in sales to remain active, not because she doesn't try, but because she can't get more people interested. So she will never get to attend a special trip or be rewarded, even though she's trying hard to sell and get others interested. Just doesn't seem fair that she's working hard with no perks. Just my 2 cents.
Yup, I'm not crazy about their trip incentives. I'm not crazy about direct sales either, and yet I'm a consultant for not one but two companies. I do it because I like the products and get them at a discount. That said, the "rainbows and unicorns" attitude of most MLMs really irritates me. The incentives flat out piss me off. We're stupid enough to go after the carrot dangling in front of our noses, which is all it is, since the average consultant will never go on any trip. In my mind, you work hard (sell lots) = you make lots of money (commission) = you go on your own trips. At least that's how the non-sales world does it. But where's the carrot in that? There isn't one. The lure of money alone isn't enough to make consultants work like crazy to maybe just maybe make it. So trips it is. Thanks for rubbing my nose in it all you MLMs. And don't get me started on all the 'feel good warm and fuzzies' they sell ya. No, convention is not going to be the greatest thing in my life, and I will not make BFFs there. Will I meet cool people? Probably. Will I have a good time? Probably. But it's not the be all and end all of life.
I'm possibly not making sense since its 4 am and I was grumpy to begin with, lol. I just keep thinking there has to be a better way to run a direct sales business, but since I'm not super business savvy, I sadly won't be the one to come up with it. And yes, the 'sell lots, make lots of money' was an over-generalization.
Ok. I'm going to ask it after trying for hours to figure it out I know I will kick myself when you answer. What is MLM? I've seen it written in several threads but can't figure it out!
Let me preface this by saying I am a SU demonstrator. I got into this for the discount but I really don't need $1200 in product every year. I have a full time job that keeps me in money and DHs job pays the bills. I am not interested in being "that person" who is constantly bothering everyone to have a party, join a club, buy something, etc. Now before anyone says you are not that person, you are. Having worked for years in a female-dominated profession, I know what people say. I have known people who have sold SU, Creative Memories, Tupperware, Home Interiors, etc etc etc It's all the same.
I have friends who love to scrapbook and/or make cards. We have talked about a "club" but finally decided that I would have a one-day-a-month sale and give a 20% discount on anything sold on that day but I would keep the "rewards" I don't run a consistent discount, just this one day a month. This has worked for me. However, the stamps are getting more expensive and if there is a price increase on ink or paper in this next catalog, I fear that this small group with be more savvy with their Hobby Lobby and Michaels coupons.
I don't especially like getting emails from any MLM person saying "I just need x more dollars for the new desk" or "Thanks for sending me to Hawaii" That money comes from somewhere, in this case in overpriced products. There really is no need for a demonstrator with You Tube and the videos people make. I would be just as happy to see SU go to all online. And I think their prices could be cheaper.
As far as all this "they are all cash" and the emotions that are involved in this business, anyone can tell you anything they want. Be discerning. There is a reason behind all these cuts.
I was a demo for two years, while holding down a 50 to 60 hour full time job. Finally something had to give and it had to be SU, an easy decision. I was only making enough to support my hobby somewhat and getting a 20% discount. Plus my purchases as a non demo benefit my demo, and that was a good thing.
Now fast forward five years. I retired last year and ready to jump back in. I love classes, meeting those who love my hobby, those who will love it once they're introdused to it, and getting together with friends. And hey, the extra money I make to help support my hobby won't hurt either. It is nice to have a company like SU that helps make this possible. Is SU perfect, absolutely not. Do I love their products, absolutely yes! I call this being fair and balanced. If it were all fun it wouldn't be called a job.
So as others give it up, I'm jumping back in. I'll be a demo again soon.
Hi Anne. I saw your post on SCS that you were going to rejoin SU as a demo. I just thought I would take a sec to see if you have heard about Fun Stampers Journey. It is a Direct Sales Stamping Company featuring unique stamps, dies, papers and more. What I like most is that the quarterly minimum is just $150 and they also give you a free website of course you get a discount/commission too if you would ever like additional information, including the three different Starter Kit options. Let me know
Without getting into details that I really couldn't quote specifically anyway, I think there is an important aspect that is missing in the discussion here. I think some things are changing globally - similar calendar timelines and such. I think a lot of the changes are stemming from the intentions for more global focus. Any time you look at processes that are more global in nature - laws, translations, etc, - the approach has to be different than one exclusively in the U.S. I know a lot of online or retail companies are global - but I imagine the party model is a different animal. I don't think SU! Will do away with the demo model - I think it is the main differentiator for them.
I am a current demo stepping down after the next catty release - after one last shopping hurrah . I've unsub bed from the demo side of SCS.
I love SU! And I wish everyone well. It's just time for me to make a shift for a number of reasons that I won't dwell on.
I am not interested in being "that person" who is constantly bothering everyone to have a party, join a club, buy something, etc. Now before anyone says you are not that person, you are.
Actually, I know for a fact that I am not that person. My main group of customers asked me to become a demo, because we weren't thrilled with our old one. I hold anywhere from 4-8 events a year depending on whether they are asking for more or not. And, without being the crazy DSA lady I will make enough to get the extra 5% next year.
I also had a wonderful Partylite rep that throws the most amazing parties that everyone asks her to have them. She has never asked me to throw a party or annoyed me with constant sales pitches. I go to her for business when I want to buy something, she provides awesome customer service, and then she leaves me alone until I am ready to buy again. And, she does enough business that it provides real income for her family.
You do not have to be the annoying DSA lady to be successful though there are lots of people like that out there who are.
I'm staying with SU. I want to stay with a company that regardless of it's up and downs has survived in today's competitive craft industry. I have much too much money invested in SU to change. If there was a problem with the product, it was always handled promptly and to my standards. It takes many years for a company to build confidence and respect from their customers. Those are points I don't think anyone would disagree with. Besides my demo would be heartbroken and disappointed if I went with another company, and she truly deserves my loyalty. So by this time next week, I'll be back to demo status. I thank all of you for comments pro and con throughout the thread, because honest and open discussions are healthy.:cool:
Actually, I know for a fact that I am not that person. My main group of customers asked me to become a demo, because we weren't thrilled with our old one. I hold anywhere from 4-8 events a year depending on whether they are asking for more or not. And, without being the crazy DSA lady I will make enough to get the extra 5% next year.
I also had a wonderful Partylite rep that throws the most amazing parties that everyone asks her to have them. She has never asked me to throw a party or annoyed me with constant sales pitches. I go to her for business when I want to buy something, she provides awesome customer service, and then she leaves me alone until I am ready to buy again. And, she does enough business that it provides real income for her family.
You do not have to be the annoying DSA lady to be successful though there are lots of people like that out there who are.
I think it really depends on the individual consultant's circumstances. Some people are naturally in situations where they don't have to solicit to get sales. Other people are. I don't have a single real life (meaning not online) friend that is into paper crafts. I'm slowly discovering through mutual Facebook groups that I do know people who are, i.e. a co-worker, but we're not friends per se. Just 'friendly'. For me to solicit my friends would really be shooting myself in the foot, I will have to find other venues to advertise, but to gain customers I will have to solicit in some form or other.
Soliciting for sales is the whole basic concept of direct sales, start with your personal network and go from there. If you're lucky and work hard at it, guests at the initial parties will book parties of their own. I don't know any direct sales company that wouldn't strongly suggest otherwise.
Long before I started as a consultant for the food company I'm involved with, I had a tradition of going out for coffee and cheesecake with two very good friends. When I merely mentioned that I would bring them samples to take home and try, they both firmly declined saying that they wanted to meet for friendship's sake, but were not in the slightest interested in the product. But how can they know that if they've never even seen or tried it? And trust me, they haven't... it is very new to Canada, and extremely new to my area. That's the MLM turn-off though. People are over-saturated, and the second they learn you sell something they run in the opposite direction. I'm still good friends with those two, we still go for coffee and cheesecake, but I never mentioned it again nor will I because frankly I was hurt that they reacted the way they did.
Fortunately in your case you had a circle of friends that wanted you to sell them SU to begin with. That's a rare thing. I'd be willing to bet that your Partylite demo had to start out with asking people to hold a party. She is clearly a people person, good at what she does, and her reputation precedes her so that she doesn't have to bug you for parties... but she had to start somewhere. And I don't recall ever going to any party-format gathering that didn't solicit in some way, shape, or form. Even more so, key to a consultant's success is coaching hostesses to invite their friends and solicit pre-sales... aka getting the hostess to be the 'annoying hostess lady', even though it's a legitimate sales tactic that bolsters the consultant's business. I don't know what's worse, the 'annoying direct sales lady' or the 'annoying hostess lady'. I mostly feel bad for anyone hosting a party, but I don't attend out of pity, only if I have at least a slight interest.
For the record, I have a consultant like your Partylite lady. I approached her, not the other way around. She just 'put it out there' and I took the bait. ;) She doesn't harass me, and when I'm out of something I put an order in. It's a nicely symbiotic relationship. She did however start out with the mass appeals, the "I'm just $X away from such and such", etc. I don't think she really does that anymore, because like your Partylite rep, she has developed a good customer base.
Don't get me wrong, I don't begrudge that this is a legitimate source of income for a lot of people, even if it is just to help pay the bills or a yearly family vacation. For me personally though, it's very painful... one of my greatest shortcomings is being overly concerned with what people think of me. So that is why I'm not a good direct sales person, because I don't want people to cringe the way I do when direct sales are mentioned.
I know this has totally gone off track from the topic of changes within SU, but I have been reading it since the beginning and have thoroughly enjoyed hearing all points of view. I hesitated to jump in, but I know crafters are a forgiving lot. ;) I'm less grumpy than last night so hopefully this post sounded nicer. :lol: And for what it's worth, I want SU to succeed particularly since they are only one of two stamping/scrapbooking direct sales companies in Canada. I wanted to join a company as a hobbyist, but it had to be CTMH or SU. I would have loved to try Fun Stampers Journey or a�muse but we don't have them here. I believe there is room for all of them, but something's gotta give in the mlm mentality... and frankly it is so entrenched that I don't even think it's possible anymore.
Kim, you said it better than I did! I am purely hobby because I am NOT buying into the MLM way of thinking. I have had three home parties in my life and all three were to "help" someone. I simply HATE asking people to buy things. There is no way you can succeed at ANY MLM plan without being a salesperson.
Years ago, when home parties were the rage, I was invited to at least one EVERY WEEK! When I complained about it to a friend, she said "Just don't go. Don't get into that racket of she went to my party so I have to go to hers. It is ridiculous" and she was right. When I stopped going to the parties, I was invited to less and less. And that was fine with me.
Fast forward twenty years........ I asked my daughter about home parties. She said she never even hears of anyone having one. She said it was "old news" so I assume that means no one does that anymore.
So back to SU and their changes....... they may last. they may not. someone like me won't make much of a difference. I do notice that my friends who stamp with me feel like I do.... what am I buying all this stuff for?
